Shutting down the GPS web service (and removing it from Subsurface apps)

[Dirk Hohndel]

Clearly this isn't something we'll do overnight. But I think it's something we should plan to phase out over the next few months.

- the companion apps are gone from the mobile stores, the mobile apps have replaced them
- uploading to the webservice from the mobile app is kinda weird, much easier to just apply the fixes on device
- our handling of the webservice ID is inconsistent, poorly designed, and even more poorly documented. See https://github.com/Subsurface-divelog/subsurface/issues/1648 <https://github.com/Subsurface-divelog/subsurface/issues/1648>
- still to this day people get confused with the GPS webservice and cloud storage. At least once a month people send me password reset requests and attach the webservice ID

So, here's what I'd like to do:

- remove support for downloading / applying GPS fixes from the webservice in 4.8.2
- remove support for uploading to the webservice in future mobile apps
- announce that we're shutting this down
- at the end of this year, turn off the server and archive the data

Comments, thoughts, suggestions?

/D

[Jan Mulder]

Post by Dirk Hohndel
Clearly this isn't something we'll do overnight. But I think it's
something we should plan to phase out over the next few months.
- the companion apps are gone from the mobile stores, the mobile apps have replaced them

Hmm. Just checked, and its still in the Google Play store, with remarks
as legacy, not supported any more, replaced by, etc. Not sure about the
Apple store.

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- uploading to the webservice from the mobile app is kinda weird, much
easier to just apply the fixes on device
- our handling of the webservice ID is inconsistent, poorly designed,
and even more poorly documented. See
https://github.com/Subsurface-divelog/subsurface/issues/1648
- still to this day people get confused with the GPS webservice and
cloud storage. At least once a month people send me password reset
requests and attach the webservice ID
- remove support for downloading / applying GPS fixes from the
webservice in 4.8.2

4.8.2 seems a bit quick (depending on what the planning will be, but my
impression is very soon). Ok, just removing the menu item, and the UI in
the preferences (the magic webservice user ID) is easy to do, but a
clean and full removal from the backend is likely to be more complex.
So, I assume you are talking here (for 4.8.2) about UI mainly, right?

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- remove support for uploading to the webservice in future mobile apps

Seems fine to me.

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- announce that we're shutting this down
- at the end of this year, turn off the server and archive the data

Yes, logical.

Post by Dirk Hohndel
Comments, thoughts, suggestions?

Just a question, as I'm not familiar with Apple stuff in any way. GPS
logging was a problem for our c/c++/Qt/QML based app on iOs. I assume
this is fixed and something from the past?

And a thought. The future solution on mobile needs also to work without
cloud account.

--jan

[Miika Turkia]

Post by Dirk Hohndel
Clearly this isn't something we'll do overnight. But I think it's something we should plan to phase out over the next few months.
- the companion apps are gone from the mobile stores, the mobile apps have replaced them

Hmm. Just checked, and its still in the Google Play store, with remarks as legacy, not supported any more, replaced by, etc. Not sure about the Apple store.

I didn’t see anything related on apple store when searching for subsurface, not even subsurface-mobile

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- uploading to the webservice from the mobile app is kinda weird, much easier to just apply the fixes on device
- our handling of the webservice ID is inconsistent, poorly designed, and even more poorly documented. See https://github.com/Subsurface-divelog/subsurface/issues/1648
- still to this day people get confused with the GPS webservice and cloud storage. At least once a month people send me password reset requests and attach the webservice ID
- remove support for downloading / applying GPS fixes from the webservice in 4.8.2

4.8.2 seems a bit quick (depending on what the planning will be, but my impression is very soon). Ok, just removing the menu item, and the UI in the preferences (the magic webservice user ID) is easy to do, but a clean and full removal from the backend is likely to be more complex. So, I assume you are talking here (for 4.8.2) about UI mainly, right?

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- remove support for uploading to the webservice in future mobile apps

Seems fine to me.

sounds sensiböe to get rid of it all

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- announce that we're shutting this down
- at the end of this year, turn off the server and archive the data

Yes, logical.

Post by Dirk Hohndel
Comments, thoughts, suggestions?

Just a question, as I'm not familiar with Apple stuff in any way. GPS logging was a problem for our c/c++/Qt/QML based app on iOs. I assume this is fixed and something from the past?

works fine nowadays

And a thought. The future solution on mobile needs also to work without cloud account.

it already does. Kind of. Right now you can manage dives and gps on single mobile device. (if dc dl is supported in the phone)

miika

[Dirk Hohndel]

Post by Miika Turkia

Post by Dirk Hohndel
Clearly this isn't something we'll do overnight. But I think it's something we should plan to phase out over the next few months.
- the companion apps are gone from the mobile stores, the mobile apps have replaced them

Hmm. Just checked, and its still in the Google Play store, with remarks as legacy, not supported any more, replaced by, etc. Not sure about the Apple store.

I didn’t see anything related on apple store when searching for subsurface, not even subsurface-mobile

Searching on the Apple Store is weird. If you search for Subsurface-mobile you'll find it, but searching for Subsurface you won't. Very odd.
I thought the companion app on Google Play was gone. I'll look into that in a moment. I know it's gone for iOS.

Post by Miika Turkia

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- uploading to the webservice from the mobile app is kinda weird, much easier to just apply the fixes on device
- our handling of the webservice ID is inconsistent, poorly designed, and even more poorly documented. See https://github.com/Subsurface-divelog/subsurface/issues/1648
- still to this day people get confused with the GPS webservice and cloud storage. At least once a month people send me password reset requests and attach the webservice ID
- remove support for downloading / applying GPS fixes from the webservice in 4.8.2

4.8.2 seems a bit quick (depending on what the planning will be, but my impression is very soon). Ok, just removing the menu item, and the UI in the preferences (the magic webservice user ID) is easy to do, but a clean and full removal from the backend is likely to be more complex. So, I assume you are talking here (for 4.8.2) about UI mainly, right?

Post by Dirk Hohndel
- remove support for uploading to the webservice in future mobile apps

Seems fine to me.

sounds sensiböe to get rid of it all

No one disagreed, so I'm merging the corresponding pull request.

/D

[Jan Mulder]

Post by Miika Turkia

And a thought. The future solution on mobile needs also to work without cloud account.

it already does. Kind of. Right now you can manage dives and gps on single mobile device. (if dc dl is supported in the phone)

Well, some more thinking on this, I think we need to realize that we
will possibly disappoint 1 type of users. The user that does not use the
online cloud storage in the new style (without web service) has not way
any more to transfer GPS data from the mobile device to a desktop
logbook. I said before "The future solution on mobile needs also to work
without cloud account", which I now believe is fundamentally impossible.

Thinking more of this ... it is what it is. If a user does not want to
share the logbook (for whatever reason), the user cannot share a small
part of the logbook (GPS data) to a different device or desktop
application as well. Where "share" means, sharing it with the online
cloud account.

--jan

[JB2Cool]

I could be that type of user and i already use a workaround.

I don't use cloud storage but I do use the Subsurface companion app but not
in the way you'd expect. I use the companion app to either take 'one time'
GPS fixes if I have easy access to my phone when we are on site or to log
it automatically if I'm not likely to be able to access my phone but I
don't actually use the webservice to transfer the data. I simply log the
data to the phone and then I screenshot the entry and manually key it into
Subsurface when I'm logging the dive
.
This works for me and has done for the last few years. I can then use this
when I'm 'off the grid' in remote places. It also enables me to use my old
sacrificial (broken) iPhone that I'm not all that bothered about rather
than my newer one that I would care if got wet/lost. I have no SIM card in
the old phone and it still does what I want.

JB

Post by Jan Mulder

Post by Miika Turkia

Post by Jan Mulder
And a thought. The future solution on mobile needs also to work without

cloud account.

Post by Miika Turkia
it already does. Kind of. Right now you can manage dives and gps on

single mobile device. (if dc dl is supported in the phone)
Well, some more thinking on this, I think we need to realize that we
will possibly disappoint 1 type of users. The user that does not use the
online cloud storage in the new style (without web service) has not way
any more to transfer GPS data from the mobile device to a desktop
logbook. I said before "The future solution on mobile needs also to work
without cloud account", which I now believe is fundamentally impossible.
Thinking more of this ... it is what it is. If a user does not want to
share the logbook (for whatever reason), the user cannot share a small
part of the logbook (GPS data) to a different device or desktop
application as well. Where "share" means, sharing it with the online
cloud account.
--jan
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[Robert Helling]

JB,

Post by JB2Cool
I could be that type of user and i already use a workaround.
I don't use cloud storage but I do use the Subsurface companion app but not in the way you'd expect. I use the companion app to either take 'one time' GPS fixes if I have easy access to my phone when we are on site or to log it automatically if I'm not likely to be able to access my phone but I don't actually use the webservice to transfer the data. I simply log the data to the phone and then I screenshot the entry and manually key it into Subsurface when I'm logging the dive
.
This works for me and has done for the last few years. I can then use this when I'm 'off the grid' in remote places. It also enables me to use my old sacrificial (broken) iPhone that I'm not all that bothered about rather than my newer one that I would care if got wet/lost. I have no SIM card in the old phone and it still does what I want.

this is really very roundabout. You could at least add the picture of the screenshot to the dive. This should copy the GPS coordinates (I am not sure if screenshot have geodata, otherwise take any picture at the dive spot). You can later delete the image, the GPS fix will stay.

Best
Robert

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Robert C. Helling Elite Master Course Theoretical and Mathematical Physics
Scientific Coordinator
Ludwig Maximilians Universitaet Muenchen, Dept. Physik
Phone: [phone] Theresienstr. 39, rm. B339
http://www.atdotde.de

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